JJ Birden was 5’ 9” and 157 lbs by the time he was drafted into the NFL.
JJ had a long and successful career of nine years in the NFL by putting in the work and doing the little things that most people are never willing to do while overcoming rejection over and over again.
In this episode, you’ll hear JJ’s journey from torn ACL to nine years in the NFL to professional speaker and everything in between.
Don’t miss this fantastic conversation with one of the hardest working and kindest people on the planet!
Episode Highlights:
01:07 - How JJ got into football
03:53 - Did JJ have any doubts about making it
05:44 - How JJ went from being a 5 ft 9 in walk-on to having a 9-year NFL career
09:08 - How JJ recovered from a torn ACL
15:33 - What drove JJ to push past the rejections
19:21 - Where JJ believed he could make an impact
22:32 - How to keep focus
25:47 - The impact JJ’s kids have had on his life
31:29 - Why you decided to start doing speaking
34:23 - How JJ grew his career through building relationships
37:19 - What JJ is most proud of in his career
39:33 - What advice JJ would give to his younger self
42:19 - How JJ handled the naysayers
50:18 - The Impact Greg made on JJ at the University of Oregon
Guest at a Glance
Despite being the #1 high school wide receiver in Oregon, JJ didn’t receive a single D1 scholarship offer. He was fast enough for sure, but at 5’9 and 133 lbs., JJ was just too small to play with the big boys. At least that’s what the naysayers thought; JJ knew he was good enough, and he set his mind to achieving the impossible. All he needed was an opportunity, no matter how small, even if it meant making his own.
Notable Quotes
“I wanted to make sure I was the talent who put in the work.”
“You will do whatever it takes. So I didn't care how many nos I got or how many times I was rejected because I knew I could play. I knew I had the physical gift. I knew I had an intelligence. I knew I have a toughness. It was just a matter of getting healthy and getting in the right situation.”
“Every Sunday night I put my weekly schedule together and make sure that I have something in place that ultimately is going to accomplish whatever the goal I have for that week.”
“Could you really sleep at night knowing you could have made a difference?”
“One of the best ways to cut down the inevitable learning curve in anything we do is finding someone who's already walked the journey, the road, that you're trying to get on.”
Greg Bell: “if you were going to go someplace, ask somebody coming back from that place. But make sure they have a smile on their face.”
“Not everyone's going to understand your journey, not everyone's going to understand the choices you make and that's okay.”
“Everybody wants it, but not everybody's willing to put in the work to get it.”
“genetics has nothing to do with you waking up at 5:00 AM and going into the gym.”
“The concept of being more than an athlete always drove me.”
Transcript
[00:00:00] Greg Bell: [00:00:00] Hi, I'm Greg Bell, and welcome to another episode of the Water the Bamboo podcast. JJ burden is a good friend and an athlete. He is a family man, which we cover and talk about in the podcast. He's also a great mentor and talks about mentor, relationship.
[00:00:32] You and I have known each other for a long, long time. I mean, way back to college. I mean, my word, it's interesting too, because you did track and field at U of O, and you played football. What I think is interesting about, I mean, just that, you know, speed is important and all those things, but, but playing football at your size, man, how in the world? Like I was like, JJ man, run fast. Those guys are big. When you think about like [00:01:00] your career, you know, you played nine years in the NFL, you've had all the success athletically. I want to just start with that.
[00:01:06] JJ Birden: [00:01:06] Okay.
[00:01:07] Greg Bell: [00:01:07] What got you going athletically, even as a kid, under sized, you know, that's sort of an important part because I imagine people around, you said, why are you playing football? Like, I mean, track made sense, but why football? Like, talk about that a little bit, your why? Why, why were you into athletics the way you were and we'll get into the other stuff later, if we can start with that.
[00:01:27] JJ Birden: [00:01:27] Yeah. It's really interesting because I wasn't the kid who was groomed to be an athlete or who had the dream was to be a professional athlete. That was never me. I was the kid in Northeast Portland who loved to play ball on the street. I mean, we grew up playing football, basketball, and having races in Northeast Portland. That was like our playground. And, you know, I realized that was pretty good. And I can remember one incident where I was playing with some high schoolers and I was in the eighth grade and we were playing [00:02:00] football and they let me play because the guy got hurt and I held my own pretty well.
[00:02:04] And I knew then that, okay, maybe athletically, I have something special, but I was content with just playing in the streets until I finally played organized ball, which was in 10th grade was when I finally played football and ran track. But what happened, Greg, at every level I played because I was a mini guy because I was a small list. Everyone, or someone always said, you shouldn't do this. You're too small. Every single level. It was 10th grade, then it was junior high, and then it was high school. And because of that, I was like, well, I'll show you. And that was the motivation. It was really to prove people wrong until I learned my senior year in high school.
[00:02:47] I didn't even understand the concept of scholarship, but when I connected really good in athletics, Free scholarship, college paid for three. I kind of liked that idea. So [00:03:00] my motivation is like, let's use athletics to get to college so I can get an education, and get a degree and get the job I want.
[00:03:09] So again, it was never about. You know, being the best track and field athlete and make an Olympics or the NFL, it just kind of happened one by one. It was a really interesting journey.
[00:03:20] Greg Bell: [00:03:20] Yeah. That's interesting. I like that idea. You took the motivation from people telling you couldn't do it. Right. It's interesting that that happens to a lot of people that people around them. You know, I talk about that in Water the Bamboo a lot, because. It takes giant timber bamboo five years before it grows. And while you're watering that bamboo, what are people going to tell you? Well, that's not going to work. It'll never happen, but it's interesting. You took that piece. What I tell people is the mind, your own bamboo, let me walk through this, but I love how you take that notion of people being doubters or whatever.
[00:03:53] But, did you have any of those doubts yourself? I just sort of like when I think about you, I think about somebody who's really [00:04:00] driven and really works hard or whatever. But did you have any self doubt on that, just on that journey yourself?
[00:04:06] JJ Birden: [00:04:06] No, I didn't. And I'll tell you why, because I knew I had the gene, the athletic gene, meaning that I was pretty fast and I had pretty amazing jumping ability.
[00:04:17] And so I had the physical gifts. And when I compared myself to the other athletes out there, I knew that I was either better or comparable to them. They just kept seeing me as a smaller guy. So I knew that they saw me as an underdog, but I didn't see myself as an underdog. And that was the key. I had that strong belief in myself because I knew I had the gift, but I also knew I had the drive to put in the work.
[00:04:44] Because as you know, there's that saying out there that, you know, hard work, beats talent. When talent doesn't work while I want to make sure I was the talent who put in the work. So there was really never a doubt, because even when I got to college, because [00:05:00] I went to Oregon on a track scholarship, I wasn't playing football.
[00:05:04] And the second year I convinced Rich Brooks to allow me to walk on. And I'll tell you, Greg, after two weeks of evaluating the college athletes, I was like, Oh yeah, I can play at this level. I'm just as fast, just as athletic. Now I just got to show them I can do it. So, no, I never really had doubt because I knew I had the gift athletically and I knew I'd back it up with the work too.
[00:05:26] Greg Bell: [00:05:26] I love that idea though, that sort of thinking about that notion you just said because a lot of people who are talented, but don't work hard. And it's interesting when you combine those two, it like you did. I mean, then you go on to have this like amazing NFL career. Help me with that, that makes no sense to me.
[00:05:44] You walked on the football team and then you keep going, like, talk about that. How do you, I mean, nine years in the NFL is a lot of time. Right. What's the average three years,
[00:05:55] JJ Birden: [00:05:55] Less than two years now.
[00:05:57] Greg Bell: [00:05:57] Less than two. Wow. Walk us through [00:06:00] that a little bit. Going from a walk-on football player to a nine year NFL career,
[00:06:06] JJ Birden: [00:06:06] Well, I wasn't planning that, I'll tell you that much. Again, it was, you know, so cause when I played high school ball and I was at Lakeridge, I was the number one wide receiver in the whole state. I had all these incredible stats, but I was 5-9, 133 pounds. So no division one school would offer me a football scholarship. I mean, personally, I took that as an insult cause I knew I was the best.
[00:06:30] So I came up with another plan. I said, somehow I'm going to play football, but I'm going to use track to do that. And as I was being recruited in the track, cause I had the number two long jump in the nation at the time in high school. So I could pick my school. Well, I wanted to stay local if I could. And when Oregon was looking to recruit me, I asked them, I said, Hey, what do you think about me one day trying football? And out of all the PAC 10 schools, Oregon was the only school that said, if you come run for us, you [00:07:00] have our blessing. If rich Brooks will let you walk on. So, all I saw was opportunity.
[00:07:05] Okay, I've got their blessing. Now I gotta do the rest. And so the second year was when I started watching the unit or the Oregon practices during the spring, had the conversation with Brooks. And even the first time I got there, we went into the fall camp, Brooks goes, I'm going to let you walk on. And I remember, Greg, going to the first day of practice and looking at a list of 15 wide receivers, and I was number 14.
[00:07:31] Now, my mentality is not like a lot of people, where some might say, well, this is a waste of my time. Why am I here? They're not going to give me a shot. I'm number 14. Well, my thought process was, how fast can I move up the depth chart? And I instantly saw it as a challenge because I knew they had doubt in me, but I knew what I could do.
[00:07:52] So when I made the team, I was like, okay, I'm running track and playing football. Cool. But my focus was track. You know, I was trying to make the [00:08:00] Olympic team. That's what I was really focusing on. So football was just something I did. So my senior year, I'm having a great track season and one of the PAC-10s qualified for national and qualified for the 1988 Olympic trials and the long jump.
[00:08:16] But then to my surprise, I get a call from the Cleveland Browns. And when I got that call, Greg, I was like, Who is this? This is the head coach, Marty Schottenheimer. We just drafted to the NFL draft. And Greg, I was like, are you serious? Cause I only had one touchdown my senior year; I only caught 19 balls.
[00:08:34] Those are not your prototypical college stats of a wide receiver who's going to go to the NFL. So it all just kind of happened as a shock to me. So, but here's what happened and this is why I ended up in the NFL. So that next week, I'm invited to the rookie camp and I'm getting ready for PAC 10s and Bill Dillinger, the track coach tells me, JJ, you're going to go to the Brown's rookie camp. Don't do the [00:09:00] drills. We need you. You've got a great chance of making the Olympic team and I'm like, Bill, I never get hurt at these things.
[00:09:08] That was the wrong thing to say, because I go to Cleveland next week. Three practices. The third practice, I tear up my ACL ligament, and that was my first serious injury setback.
[00:09:23] But that is when everything switched, because, my approach has always been, I'm a very positive person. So the positive mindset is okay, one doorway closes, there's another one over here. Let's go through that. And so that turned,
[00:09:38] Greg Bell: [00:09:38] Wait, wait, wait, wait, I got to interrupt you there. Like, Whoa, wait a minute. One door closes, another one opens, that's way too cliche. Where do you get that? My goodness, like at that age and that stage, here you are. You know, your track coach is telling you not to go to the camp. You blow your ACL. I mean, I forgot about this story, but I mean, help the audience with this sort of [00:10:00] switch. A lot of people honestly, would have just crawled up on their couch and went, man, I just blew my chance at the Olympics. Where does that come from? Where do you get that idea to switch gears like that? Because we see the posters, but where do you personally get that?
[00:10:14] JJ Birden: [00:10:14] Since day one, I have always had this positive mindset. It's just how I've always been. You know, the environment I was raised in, it was, you know, it was pretty tough. You know, I watched different things my family members and friends did, but I always have this positive mindset that, Hey, I can control the direction of my life. I'm going to do what I want to do. So when that moment happened, and when I tore my ACL, don't get me wrong, I was crushed. And I remember sitting in the treatment center crying because all I kept thinking about is I can't go to PAC 10s. I can't go to nationals. There's no shot at the Olympic trials. But then I kind of snapped out of it. I said, well, I'm here in the Cleveland Browns training center. They have to get me back to health. They just they're [00:11:00] responsible for my knee injury. So I thought, how can I seize and maximize opportunity.
[00:11:05] And after talking to my agent, talked to Cleveland, Cleveland said, we're going to keep you on IR for a year. So I thought, wait a minute. I'm in the NFL. I really don't even believe I can play any NFL, but I get to sit on IR for a year and get healthy and learn all the positions and see if I can really do this and increase my belief system.
[00:11:27] That was probably the best thing that could have happened to me, because, even when I was drafted, Greg, and I went to my first practice, I was like, there's no way I can play in the NFL.
[00:11:38] Greg Bell: [00:11:38] Wow. But I love that because, I mean, it's your title of your book when opportunity knocks, right? Yeah. It's interesting. I mean, it seems like opportunity knocked you on your butt, right. But you look at it and go, okay, here I am. And sort of assess the situation. And a lot of people right now, we're in COVID right there. Everybody's been knocked down. It just sort of, it [00:12:00] makes that sort of concept taking that athletic concept getting knocked down, getting back up and finding opportunity where you are is such a powerful message.
[00:12:11] When I think about the bamboo farmer that you are, that's what you really got to do. It's like, how do you pivot, and keep that positive mindset, no matter what is happening in your world. So, so difficult to do well, that's a difficult thing to pull off and honestly, you've done it in so many ways.
[00:12:30] Like being an undersized player, being a walk-on football player, making it to the league, but then hurting yourself in the Browns. Keep going with the story because I think it's just fascinating.
[00:12:42] JJ Birden: [00:12:42] Well, what's interesting is like, if you've looked at any of my content, there's an acronym I use a lot. It's called FASCO and it represents failures, adversity, setbacks, challenges, and obstacles.
[00:12:55] I've just kind of wrapped them all into one word, but you hear different [00:13:00] moments of where I dealt with FASCO and when I dealt with that. But I've always looked at those opportunities of growth. I think it's one of the best teachers and mentors you can have, is when you deal with a setback or rejection.
[00:13:12] So that moment I saw the opportunity again, to sit there and learn and get better. But what was interesting, the real task came the next two years because I went to camp the next year. I'm 85%. I'm going through and I'm like, okay, I'm probably still gonna make the team. So they cut me. You realize that I'm not even a hundred percent.
[00:13:33] They cut me. It's a business. They can do what they want. As soon as they cut me, I get calls from the Chiefs, the Packers, and the Lions. And over those three days, I go to each city and I flunked each team's physical. Cause I've got swelling in my knees. So I go through a five day period where I'm rejected by four NFL teams.
[00:13:57] So you want to talk about a test of [00:14:00] how bad you really want it. But again, like you asked me at the beginning, I never thought about quitting because I saw the talent. I saw who I was competing against. And I knew that I just had to get healthy, get in the right situation. And so I just continued to work and wait for that shot and Cowboys called me and put me on their practice squad and said, they're going to play me at some point this year.
[00:14:26] And I was on the practice squad the entire year. I never gotten a game when the season was over. Jimmy Johnson, the head coach said, we don't think you're going to be able to play in the NFL. So we're not bringing you back and they let me go.
[00:14:40] Greg Bell: [00:14:40] Whoa. Really that's fun.
[00:14:45] JJ Birden: [00:14:45] Yeah. It's like, it's really, they fired you.
[00:14:50] Greg Bell: [00:14:50] Just thinking about like, I mean, part of what I really think is interesting. So I have this sort of theory. I think winning is easy, right? You know, when you're winning and [00:15:00] life is going great, that's actually pretty easy, right? Almost expected, but losing, man, how do you recover from loss is will show you who you are, that idea that if you want to know who a person is, give them everything they want or take it away.
[00:15:14] So you'll know who that is. Right? When a lot of people, a lot of things have been taken away. Their Bamboo's been sort of wiped out. And then you got to replant and rewater and get it going again. It just sounds like that's really an important thing. One of the questions I do know about you, you asked this of your audiences when you do your keynote speeches.
[00:15:33] And that, that question is what drives you. I mean, that question is really a great question. I noticed that you asked that question of audiences because sort of having that why, that part of it, what drove you then? Let's just say you're like in the rejection phase though, what drove you to take those, you know, five rejections as you, as you describe, and then sort of get that, you know, it seems like, I mean, [00:16:00] some people would just.
[00:16:01] I honestly think what just really walk away, but you kept going, what drives you? What drove you then? Actually, that's what I'd be curious about.
[00:16:10] JJ Birden: [00:16:10] Good question. Because our why changes, but what was driving me at the time and I think you might appreciate this, being raised in Northeast Portland. We struggled growing up and I can remember being on food stamps and walking down to the laundry mat, washing our clothes and food was questionable at times.
[00:16:26] And I just decided at a very young age, I wanted more, I want more. And I said, I want to leave the hood. I want to see the world, but I want to be able to create future opportunities for myself and my future family. That's what my why was. So that was driving me. And so I was holding on to that because when I got to the NFL and I saw the potential where, you know, you're making some pretty good income where you could really create some pretty amazing opportunities for yourself and your family.
[00:16:55] So. That was my, why was really essential for break the cycle because a [00:17:00] lot of my family members and friends were choosing the same thing and they just stayed in this cycle where they just struggled and, and I wanted it more so. And as you know, and you've heard me say. When the, why is strong enough, the process to get there is not a challenge.
[00:17:14] You will do whatever it takes. So I didn't care how many nos I got or how many times I was rejected because I knew I could play. I knew I had the physical gift. I knew I had an intelligence. I knew I have a toughness. It was just a matter of getting healthy and getting in the right situation. So that's why when Dallas rejected me, and I had teams calling me, I said, okay, JJ, you're now a hundred percent.
[00:17:40] You're running a four-three you're at your best, you have to make the right business decision. And there was some exciting teams that were after me, but when I analyze against what each team I saw, I saw lack of speed, nobody read as fast as we had the wide receiver position. The new head coach was the coach who drafted me in [00:18:00] Cleveland.
[00:18:00] So I thought he's probably going to give me more opportunities. And so I felt that was the right situation for me. And they signed me, and dude, I took advantage of it.
[00:18:10] Greg Bell: [00:18:10] Oh, I I'll say I'll say, I mean that, I love that idea though. Taking you back to your why. I mean, cause I know that drives me even today, you know, thinking about living with my grandfather, in a shack with no running water, no indoor plumbing and all of that.
[00:18:26] So I know we have that sort of in common that sort of drive and food stamps and we get that. But it's interesting about that sort of kindling that in you, like that, why thinking about your future family? I think that's an interesting thought because you know, you're a young at the time, but you're thinking about, you're like my future family. I want to break the cycle.
[00:18:48] It's interesting because the bamboo farmer, the second chapter in Water the Bamboo I talk about is you gotta have a vision for what the heck you're going to do. Cause if you don't, and see your future self, any road will get you there. But I love that idea, how you're thinking [00:19:00] well, for my future self, my future family, I want to have impact.
[00:19:04] And that's one of the things when I think about you and what I know about you, even back in college, I was like, man, just hanging out with you. Impact was a big part of who you are. I imagine that still sticks with you today. I don't want to sort of label you as the impact guy, but that's what I think about that.
[00:19:21] It's like JJ impact guy, but I want to, I want you to talk about impact from your perspective, like, what do you think about when you think about that word?
[00:19:30] JJ Birden: [00:19:30] I think about depending on what it is that's driving you, what's important to you. I think we can all make an impact. That means we can make a difference.
[00:19:38] We just have to decide where we want to make the impact. You know, for me, I realized that because when I retired from NFL, Greg, I had these dreams of becoming an entrepreneur and I own a couple of businesses, you know, it didn't, it wasn't very fulfilling. It was a little frustrating and all that. And I wanted to coach and I dabbled in some coaching, but I, I hated the fact that you were [00:20:00] restricted.
[00:20:00] Like you couldn't work with these kids cause they went to a different school and the parents were all upset. So it took me a while to figure out the impact I can make. And now the platform I have as a speaker, I can do that because last time I checked, there are no NFL players that I know of, and within this time period, it was 30, 40 years.
[00:20:24] That played as long as me at my size, 5' 10" 157. I don't know of anyone that played as long as me. So I'm kind of a rare individual. So I figured I can take my story, my lessons, and make an impact on the people out there. Who've had doubt. Who've had fear. Who's felt like an underdog. Not even just athletics.
[00:20:45] It could be just in the business world. You know, I had a conversation with a guy two weeks ago and he told me he felt like an underdog at work because the guy who worked next to you went to Harvard and he went to this other local college and they did the same job because [00:21:00] of the different and schooling he felt like an underdog.
[00:21:03] So the point is I felt that the, my journey and what I've dealt with and what I've learned, that I could make an impact. On anyone out there not focusing on any specific area, but providing value and allow the listener to take that information, to see where they can apply to their lives. And hopefully it'll make an impact on their life.
[00:21:22] Greg Bell: [00:21:22] I love that. I love that idea because I think a lot of people. Deal with, I mean, maybe the person you're talking to deal with that imposter syndrome. Like, am I supposed to be here? Am I supposed to be in the NFL? Am I supposed to be a speaker? Am I supposed to, you know, all of those things, but I love how your work seems so inside out.
[00:21:43] Like having your own internal belief, that belief in yourself. you know, I, I talk about that a lot in Water the Bamboo, this idea of believing in yourself, but also believing in the process, leaving in the watering and having that kind of faith in whatever you're putting out. So I just so [00:22:00] admire and appreciate that sort of that message.
[00:22:02] And one question though, I have, how do you think about this for people, folks listening, people get distracted by so many things. Like, you know, I, I call them pandas, you know, fears, uncertainty, doubt, whatever, like pandas, they eat your bamboo. How do you keep yourself on track with your goals? I mean, having the intent to write a book like you did best-selling author, doing what you did like really pivoting your career. I mean, you've had, I don't know, three careers by now? But pivoting that way. And how do you keep focus though? Like, what's your methodology there? Cause I think your discipline is something worthy of sort of just noting, but how do you keep focused. Keep that audience in mind with that question because a lot of people get so distracted. I mean, rejection or excuse, whatever it might be, but how do you personally do that?
[00:22:53] JJ Birden: [00:22:53] Well, for me, I'm very structured. I'm very structured. It's one of the things I really appreciate of being an athlete, [00:23:00] especially a football player, because we're always told where to be when to be there and what we're going to do when we get there, we don't have much structure. Right. You know, from the morning you went in at 6:30 am and then when you left at 6:00 pm, they had you on a certain schedule. And so when I retired from the NFL, I wanted to take that structure and implement it in my life after football, and I've continued to do that. So I'm really big in this schedule is every Sunday night I put my weekly schedule together and, you know, make sure that I have something in place that ultimately is going to accomplish whatever the goal I have for that week. And then every night, before each day I review the next day schedule because sometimes you got to make some adjustments along the way, but my whole goal is to wake wake up and hit the ground running. I don't want to wake up guessing and wondering what do I gotta do because I want to be on purpose because that's what I was taught as an athlete.
[00:23:59] And I [00:24:00] still do the same thing to this day. And one of the recommendations I always give to people, I say, when you do this, make sure, you know what your daily method of operation. John Maxwell, you know, well-known author and trainer. He talks about that concept. That every day, when you sit down at your job, whatever you're working on, whatever your goal is, you should know your rule of five.
[00:24:22] What are the five fundamental things you do every single day to be successful? And I love that. Because then, you know, I was a wide receiver, but there were five fundamental things I did every single day to put myself in a position to be successful on Sunday. And so I've taken that concept now, you know, as a speaker, too. So I'm all about structure. This is it's hard work and I feel how I'm more productive.
[00:24:48] Greg Bell: [00:24:48] I absolutely love that because it it's actually you're offering your own life. Right. You're actually, you know that for me, that's what the quote unquote, the bamboo farmer does is they have to be the author of their life.
[00:25:00] [00:24:59] You're sitting around waiting for somebody to tell you what to do and how to do it. Well, good luck. I love that concept too, that you just gave was like be on purpose, people have really good intent, whether it's their diet, whether it's how they raise their kids or anything like that, that intent is there.
[00:25:18] But if they don't pay attention to the routine, you know, you get nothing I meant to our wanted to. so that's really, really helpful.
[00:25:26] One of the things that sort of, I want to sort of dive into some personal things with you, just cause I know you a little bit, if you, if you don't mind sharing this, but I know that you you've been married to your wife for like 20 something years...
[00:25:38] JJ Birden: [00:25:38] 30 years,
[00:25:39] Greg Bell: [00:25:39] my word. back in college, right? And so what I think about that, you know, I know that you have a big family. You got a few kids there. Talk to us a little bit about that relationship and also just talk about your kids, like the impact that they've had on your life.
[00:25:58] JJ Birden: [00:25:58] Absolutely. And I think you [00:26:00] alluded to this earlier, when I talked about my future family, having my own family was so important to me because, the environment I was raised in it's like, it was common for everyone to be divorced. It was common for my cousins and everybody to have different fathers and all that other stuff. So having my own family, my own wife, it was just so important to me. So when I met my wife at the university of Oregon, we started dating for three years.
[00:26:26] When we got married, I just knew she was the one I said, I'm going to be with her forever. And, our goal was have three children and we certainly do have three children with Jordan jr., Dante, and Camille. And things are going great. This happy family of five, but, 13 years ago, I got a call from my nephew, Justin Verdun in Tulsa, Oklahoma unexpectedly.
[00:26:49] And there were some problems in Tulsa. So my wife's like, you know, you got to go fly out and check on your five neices and nephews. So I fly out to Tulsa, check on them. And 24 hours later, Greg, [00:27:00] I'm in a courthouse standing before the judge and the judge is like, Mr. Birden, we're going to take your five nieces and nephews and placed in five separate foster homes.
[00:27:09] Greg Bell: [00:27:09] Oh, no way.
[00:27:09] JJ Birden: [00:27:09] Yeah. You're the next of kin. What would you like to do? So now, imagine being in that situation where I'm just there to check on them. And now you're faced with a decision that's going to affect everybody's lives, but I did what any smart husband would do. I said, judge, let me call my wife first.
[00:27:33] Greg Bell: [00:27:33] Let me call my wife. I like that.
[00:27:35] JJ Birden: [00:27:35] Unfortunately, the heart of my wife, we had a five minute conversation. We were like, Let's take them all. And we immediately merged our five nieces and nephews into our family. And we went from a family of five to a family of ten overnight, just like that.
[00:27:51] Greg Bell: [00:27:51] Wow.
[00:27:51] JJ Birden: [00:27:51] And, it had had its ups and downs, you know, there was a learning curve there, but in the end it's turned out really well.
[00:27:58] I think not only have we impacted [00:28:00] their lives, I think they've really impacted our lives too. And that's what my wife and I wanted. We saw it as an opportunity to make an impact five more lives. And so it's been very rewarding. Definitely,
[00:28:11] Greg Bell: [00:28:11] Man, I mean, it's interesting. I think back to your book when opportunity knocks, it's interesting that you sort of think about that is just, that's super remarkable because a lot of people honestly wouldn't have done it, right.
[00:28:26] Just because I got mine. I'm good. But seeing things as an opportunity and then looking at how you can help and influence others, but then I like how you talk about them impacting you. That's a really a critical thing to think about. I think about when a person goes to give, and to be helpful and to be impactful, they benefit, always.
[00:28:50] It's just, it's just, I've never been in a situation where I've went to give and be helpful that I not get something out of that. So I like how you talk about that. I've heard that in [00:29:00] some of your talks and so it's just really, it's a super powerful story. I mean, I actually, while you were telling I was getting goosebumps, I was like, wow.
[00:29:07] JJ Birden: [00:29:07] Every time I tell their story, I still get goosebumps because it's just, my wife and I, we had a conversation. We thought, we said, could you really sleep at night knowing you could have made a difference?
[00:29:19] Greg Bell: [00:29:19] Whoa.
[00:29:19] JJ Birden: [00:29:19] And we just kind of focus on those words and we both just said, no, we can't. And it was a done deal, but for everybody listening, I want everyone to know though it was not easy.
[00:29:30] And it was, it was a major learning curve trying to merge two families, and we went through probably a six month period where everybody was budding heads. But we realized when we were making a mistake at first, we kind of separated everybody, the two nephews together and the two nieces and then my kids.
[00:29:49] And then we just said, you know what? You keep telling everyone, we're one family. We need to live like that. They always switched it up and we had my nephew with my older son and my middle [00:30:00] nephew. We just switched everybody up. And then we just saw our family just blossom because that is when I think everybody thought we were one family.
[00:30:08] Greg Bell: [00:30:08] Right. Yeah. One of the chapters in Water the Bamboo is I call it it's messy in the garden. Like it's just, sometimes it's messy and you know, there's weeds and there's rocks and there's, you know, you just got to deal with it. And one of the things that sort of, I mean, just our entire conversation, you know, like, I'm going to go to U of O, I'm going to do track and then you're doing football and then you get drafted.
[00:30:29] I mean, it's messy, right? Because I think most people think success is this linear path. Right. Like, it's like, you know, you do this, you do this step, you do this step, you do this step, you know, in my experience and it doesn't sound like it's yours. Does it ever work that way? But you have to be looking for the opportunity to have impact.
[00:30:45] That's a really, the key thing I think I take from that message. But another thing that sort of strikes me as that, as you talked about sort of blending your family that way, my grandfather gave me the saying when I was really young, he said that [00:31:00] everybody leaves a wake. And, you know, like a boat, you leave awake in the water, we all leave wakes.
[00:31:06] And he he's just said, what do you want your wake to be? Like, what, how, how do you want to have that impact? And I, so when I, when I think about you, I think about family and I think about this idea of sort of that future focus like, Oh, I'm going to, I want to have a great life for myself, my family, but then I also see you now you go from this entrepreneurial, you're doing all these keynotes all over the world and all that. Tell us a little bit about how and why you started doing that. I mean, I get the impact part, but give us your why in that space, if you would.
[00:31:38] JJ Birden: [00:31:38] Well, it's, it's one of those things where it was something I always was intrigued with, but something I wasn't really focusing on.
[00:31:47] And what I mean is that when I first got to the NFL, I learned that during the off season, NFL players can do speaking engagements. You can go to schools and go to communities and go to organizations and speak and they would [00:32:00] pay you to do it. I didn't like speaking in front of people, but I thought here's a way to make some extra money, but here's a way to develop a skill that I probably could use later. And so I started this process about six or seven years in my career. I would do that. And then whenever I hosted, like, you know, even the companies I had, I was very comfortable speaking in front of people.
[00:32:21] And then I'll tell you, 13 years ago, I got involved in network marketing and direct sales. And because I was a natural speaker and the companies kept putting me on stage. And so about seven, eight years ago, I'm on stage and I'm speaking to 15,000 people and, Greg, they sent me the CD of this presentation and I'm sitting there looking at myself and I'm like, man, look at me, I'm speaking, I'm clear, I'm making some good points. I'm not nervous. And I thought, maybe this is something I could revisit.
[00:32:54] Now at this point, I don't really know how to do it, but I had a [00:33:00] friend who knew of her friend, Dr. Will Moreland, who is a well-known speaker author. And he just happened to be having a seminar that Sunday and my buddies trying to get me to go, it's Sunday, and I'm like, dude, I'm sleeping in, I don't want to go. He goes, you got to meet Dr. Will. Well, it was one of the best decisions I made because I went to the seminar. I sat there and watched Dr. Will for three hours. And I said, that's going to be my mentor because I'm a firm believer in having mentors. I've had mentors throughout my life, I still do. And I said, that's the mentor that's going to help me write my book and launch my speaking career. So that was the beginning of the process of really starting this road to becoming a professional speaker.
[00:33:39] Greg Bell: [00:33:39] Wow. I love that because I, you kind of led to my question because I talk about this concept of a bamboo circle, because a lot of people think they got to do things alone, you know, like you're all alone to get success, like this myth of the singular genius.
[00:33:57] And I know for me, in terms of professional speaking, I know I've had [00:34:00] mentors and help from tons of people. I rely on a lot of people to sort of support me as I go. But one of the thoughts though, I had, as you were sort of talking about that for you, you've had bamboo circles all your life. It sounds like because I mean, honestly, to sort of think about where you came from and what you've done in your life and your career and the success you've had, you should be a different kind of statistic, JJ.
[00:34:23] I mean, really right. But you sort of figured that relationship part out early on in your life. Like who's in my circle and thinking about that mentorship and that piece, where in the heck do you get that? You know, it's like a survival tactic, but you're thriving now. How did you come up with this idea to rely on relationships the way you do?
[00:34:43] You're very skilled at that.
[00:34:44] JJ Birden: [00:34:44] Yeah. You know, it's a great question. I think it was just inate. I'm very observant. Even as a young age, I would see someone really good at something. And I would like, I think there was, I want to be able to do that. So, how do you do that? Go ask him how they did that. And [00:35:00] that's what I started doing in grade school, older kids who were, maybe they were great at football or basketball, and even in mathematics.
[00:35:08] And I just had this natural ability to ask questions and I went through just different stages of my life and I would get like in high school and I would think, okay, who is the experienced veteran wide receiver or who's the really good, you know, last unit who can I learn from it? I've continued to do that at every level.
[00:35:26] I remember being in the NFL, getting drafted, looking at the roster and trying to see who's the oldest receiver on this team. And when I got to Kansas city, it was Stephon Page. So I said, okay, I'm going to follow him and learn from him, but he's going to have it because I think one of the best ways to cut down the inevitable learning curve in anything we do is finding someone who's already walked the journey, the road that you're trying to get on. And especially if it's someone who is leading by example, they're out there doing the deal.
[00:35:56] For for, I've always responded to [00:36:00] people like that. I can remember you probably, do you remember getting Von Ray Johnson?
[00:36:05] Greg Bell: [00:36:05] Absolutely.
[00:36:06] JJ Birden: [00:36:06] See, Von Ray Johnson, trainer in Portland, Oregon was one of the first trainers I had at age 15 and we would run these workouts together.
[00:36:14] But Von Ray who was probably 15 years older than me, he would always run the workouts with me. And I was so impressed. I'm thinking this guy is 15 years older than me and he's running these 200 and these 300s with me, that made such an impact on me that I continue to look for people that were doing that.
[00:36:34] Walking the walk and talking the talk. And so, I just believe it, you know, when you got to work with someone, make sure it's someone who is leading by example.
[00:36:42] Greg Bell: [00:36:42] Yeah. Sort of, you can just see, just find the model, see what they're actually doing. That's really, that's an important thing. One of the ways my, grandfather, he told me if you were going to go someplace, ask somebody coming back from that place, but make sure they have a smile on their face.
[00:36:58] You know, you don't want to ask somebody that's like all [00:37:00] grumpy and had a horrible time. You gotta be careful who you are ask, I guess. But one of the things that I would ask you though, is you've had a lot of success in your career. You Watered the Bamboo on the athletic field, as an entrepreneur. Now you're watering it as a speaker, but if you sorta peel all that back from a business perspective, what are you most proud of in your career? What's like, it could be two or three things, but is there something you're thinking, man, I'm really proud of that. Like what, what would that be?
[00:37:29] JJ Birden: [00:37:29] I think it might have to be making it to the NFL. Because when I look at the statistics of what it takes for a high school player, to make it to the NFL, it's like zero, 0.08% in college.
[00:37:44] It's a 1.6% chance of a college athlete making it to the NFL. And if you make it to the NFL, the average career is less than two years, but the average size football player is 6' 2", 245 lbs. And [00:38:00] so when you look at me, 5' 10", 157 lbs, I mean, I, I pulled off the impossible. It's very rare. If ever you will see that, I'm very proud of that achievement because as you've learned, there are so many times I could quit.
[00:38:16] So many times I could have came up with an excuse and went another direction, but I'm just proud of the fact that I had this resilience and this drive to continue on. I had no idea I would play nine years, but because of that journey and the failures and the wins and the losses. It shaped me who I am today. And I can teach from that perspective, because I know everybody has been in that situation where they valid themselves. They've looked at the odds and maybe they quit and gave up. And I think you and I both know that one of the greatest pains in life is woulda, coulda should've.
[00:38:58] Greg Bell: [00:38:58] Yeah, I think I got the [00:39:00] title for your next book and, the impossible man.
[00:39:03] JJ Birden: [00:39:03] I like that because I'm floating around with different titles.
[00:39:08] Greg Bell: [00:39:08] Yeah. I mean, you are the impossible man. I really admire that because it's like, I dunno. It's sort of like you think about like all that. I mean, the odds of making it, even if you do are at that size are still small. You know what I mean? It's like, and so to sort of get that, I liked that sort of point to that, but if you were to think about all the success, you've had, all the things you've done in your career and that you're still impacting, you know, it's not, you're not retired. I know that. What advice would you give your younger self? You know, thinking when you were a kid, if you had all the knowledge you have now, and you were to instill it in little JJ, what advice would you give JJ?
[00:39:46] JJ Birden: [00:39:46] Someone just asked me this question recently, and I'm going to surprise you with my answer. I would tell little JJ to not be afraid of taking more difficult classes in high school. [00:40:00] Oh, I graduated with a really nice GPA, but Greg, I didn't challenge myself.
[00:40:05] I avoided the hard classes. I avoided, you know, foreign language classes. And I remember when I got to Oregon, I graduated, but I remember having to retake basic classes that I should have taken in high school. And so I had to start over almost, and it took me five years to graduate, but I would probably tell little 15 year old JJ, challenge yourself academically, take those harder classes, take that foreign language class because you probably will surprise yourself because, because of the environment I was raised in, nobody went to college.
[00:40:38] I went to that period academically, where I felt inferior to my classmates. And one of the reasons why is because in sixth grade, I was, my mom got us involved in the busing program where they were busing African-American children from Northeast Portland to the affluent schools in Lake Oswego. It [00:41:00] was the program they had back then.
[00:41:01] And I can remember the first time going in the class. And just feeling from an academic standpoint inferior, just because I just felt I wasn't as smart as the other kids and how it was a six or seven year process of building up my confidence and my belief from an academic standpoint that I can really stand on two feet compared to all the other children out there.
[00:41:25] So, so that's the thing I would say, I'd say, believe in yourself, academically, as much as you believe in yourself, athletically.
[00:41:33]Greg Bell: [00:41:33] That's a really good message. I mean, for so many reasons, but even I imagine you could apply that now. I mean, I'm sorta thinking about the audience, you know, so people that are now having to actually shift their career entirely, they're going to have to challenge themselves academically.
[00:41:50] One of the things that the bamboo farmer always believes in is continuous improvement. If you think, you know, everything, you know, you're going to be irrelevant really fast, you know? And so [00:42:00] I love that idea of sort of thinking back to your, you know, like if you challenge yourself earlier in the process, just like you did athletically, well, it's gonna pay off down the road.
[00:42:09] There's no, I don't know anyone that sort of challenges themselves at a younger age or whatever and regretted it. That's really, that's a really good advice. I like that a lot. One question I have is this idea if you thought about a question that I should probably ask if you were me of you, is there any question that I should be asking you that I haven't asked you yet? How's that?
[00:42:34] JJ Birden: [00:42:34] I'd probably say, how did you ask me how did I handle the naysayers.
[00:42:40] Greg Bell: [00:42:40] Yeah, that's a great question. Probably have many of them.
[00:42:45] JJ Birden: [00:42:45] I had so many of them.
[00:42:48] Greg Bell: [00:42:48] How do you handle naysayers, JJ? That's a great question.
[00:42:50] JJ Birden: [00:42:50] And I tell you how I handled it. Even at a young age. I figured this out and I articulate it now, but what I learned was this, that not everyone's going to [00:43:00] understand your journey, not everyone's going to understand the choices you make and that's okay.
[00:43:06] It's not for them to understand your dreams, your why, and, and the direction you go. And the key is you have to understand your journey. You have to believe in it, and then you have to commit to it. You have to be willing to put in the work. And I think just following that formula has never stopped me because I had these naysayers and dream stealers along the way.
[00:43:29] And some of the dream stealers, that came from my own family members. I had some cousins that were very, very athletic, even more athletic than me, but because they made other choices. And when I made it, they did everything they could to try to crush my dreams psychologically, you know, but I realized again, Hey, you made your decision and that's okay, I'm going in this direction.
[00:43:52] But it's the commitment part. And I mean, this is where people fail sometime because. You can have the why you can have the plan, you can have the dream. [00:44:00] Everybody wants it, but not everybody's willing to put in the work to get it. Not everyone's willing to battle through those tough days when you have those wall kicking moments.
[00:44:11] And that's the thing I encourage people to do is that when you have those tough days of wall kicking moments, those are opportunities for breakthroughs. And to get a breakthrough, you make a choice. Either, it's going to take you down and out, or it's going to take you to bigger and better things. And so every time I had that, that moment, like when I got rejected by those five teams, I told my wife, I said, this is going to be my moment.
[00:44:35] This will be the moment we will talk about that that took my career to another level.
[00:44:40] Greg Bell: [00:44:40] Wow. I just got so fired up. They're like, yeah, that's good. That's really, really good stuff. Because I think that the it's very, very interesting. Doubt is really, probably the most wicked thing there is because it doesn't take a lot.
[00:44:56] And you, even in your own mind, you can have sort of this naysayer or the [00:45:00] doubt. The, in your own mind or dream stealers, you called it or someone else, that's interesting that people close to you, that they sort of, you know, can do that. You know, I always tell people crabs in a bucket, rarely get out, right.
[00:45:12] It's just kind of pulling each other down. And then this idea of like minding your own bamboo, like really kinda knowing what your plan is. You gotta take the energy to put it into it, but I liked your twist on the commitment part because. That's actually the trick right there, even though you may have your own doubt, even though there may be naysayers around you, but I like your twist on commitment.
[00:45:35] It's actually more about execution than it is about sort of the thing in your head. Can you talk a little bit about that?
[00:45:42] JJ Birden: [00:45:42] Because people have challenged me on that and said, Oh, you made it because of this reason you made it because of that reason. And I remember responding one time to someone and said, genetics has nothing to do with you waking up at 5:00 AM and going into the gym.
[00:45:55] Genetics, have nothing to do with you opening up that playbook and studying and [00:46:00] memorizing all those plays or putting in the extra training when it's a hundred degree weather. It comes to the commitment and how bad do you want it and what are you willing to do to get it? And there's always a separation there and I've seen it at different levels.
[00:46:15] Even when I got to the NFL. As you alluded to earlier, there were guys that had their, you know, their first serious injury or they, they weren't playing as much because they're used to being the star and they have that moment where they got the NFL, where they're fighting to make the team and mentally these guys would check out. But for me mentally, I thought I'm here. So every day is going to be my game day. I'm going to show up on film every day. So they're talking about me, but if they don't sign me here, there's other teams that see me on film. So again, I was always about the opportunity and maximize it and then having the right mindset, too.
[00:46:54] Greg Bell: [00:46:54] Absolutely. Man, I got a lot of book titles for you as you talk, [00:47:00] every day is game day. Well, that's like mind blowing right there because that actually, that idea, I mean, kind of tied to your, your notion of commitment, because I think people have a real easy time with excuses because who doesn't have a hard time, like everyone has a setback, it's sort of part of it.
[00:47:17] And if you sort of lean into the reasons and the excuses, it's very, very difficult to get results. But having that every day is game day mentality. Like everyday I can improve get better. I've had that one for a long, long time, but it's just interesting the way you tie it together. That's really interesting.
[00:47:35] Cause you say that people have challenged that idea. You've been fortunate athletically and so on. A lot of people have been fortunate athletically, but, did they show up at the 5:00 AM workout. Do they continue to put in the time? And you can transfer that to leadership and business and life. And anything else.
[00:47:51] I didn't get up at 5:00 AM though. Not doing it JJ,
[00:47:55] JJ Birden: [00:47:55] I'll tell you this, Greg, though, I really understood that concept when [00:48:00] I got to the NFL, because when I got to the NFL, I saw quickly that everybody was a great athlete. Everyone had the physical gifts, everybody was hungry. So think about this. There are 1,696 men that make it through an active NFL roster during the season.
[00:48:17] And all these guys are great athletes. So I quickly realized that you have to make these small incremental improvements in your game. You're constantly looking for improvements. To get better and separate yourself from your competitor. Who's going to be the guy that's behind you. But that was the difference between whether you play on Sunday versus watching the game from your sofa on Sunday, because every day, every player would bring their best, whether it was practice, it was meetings, it was treatment. It was the weight room. They brought your best. So you had the search for the little small improvements and those small improvements was the difference maker.
[00:48:56] Greg Bell: [00:48:56] Yeah, I like, I like that because I call them tiny targets, you [00:49:00] know, like if you can just sort of incrementally improve whatever it is you're working on, but you can't water it all, right. You can't water all the bamboo. I liked your idea of sort of planning. These are my five things. This is what I got to do and really committing to that piece. How do people get ahold of you? How do we, if you want to just sort of open that up, obviously on the other end, I can sort of talk about this, give them your, your socials in that, but tell us what you're working on.
[00:49:26] How can we get in touch with you? Anything like that?
[00:49:28] JJ Birden: [00:49:28] Yeah, I would say one is my website, JJBirden.com. That's my hub, where you can access anything JJ related to speaking through my social media channels, I'm all over social media. I'm under JJ Birden. I see the value of social media. I love it because I love the engagement.
[00:49:46] I love to connect with people, but I also love that the platforms give you an opportunity to serve others, to give them some kind of content that might help them get through the day. So, but I am officially in my sixth year as a paid [00:50:00] professional speaker. So I'm. I'm continuing to work on my craft.
[00:50:04] I'm continuing to get better because it's like the NFL. I watch film of my speaking engagements and I listen and I just, I critique myself cause I just, I want to be the best of the best. I'm constantly trying to get better as a presenter. And I'll tell you who, you know, you're one of the speakers I studied, you know, about five or six years ago.
[00:50:24] Because I knew of you and I knew you were speaking and you're one of those athletes I really respect, and you don't realize the impact you made on me at Oregon. And I don't even know if you remember the conversation, and I'm going here because I want to make the point that everybody should, you know, there are some mentors that you're communicating with and there's some mentors who are mentors and they don't even know they're mentoring you.
[00:50:46] But I remember a conversation with you and I, when you were in there law school at the university of Oregon and I was in my junior or senior year. And you told me, you said you should consider going to [00:51:00] law school. You said you would be great. You know, you, you should really think about taking the LSAT, I think it's called it. And I've thought about that for a while, but what impressed me about you was you aren't just an athlete, you know, you were more than an athlete. And so when I heard you are a speaker. I looked you up and I looked at all your stuff and you inspired me too. So I want to thank you too for leading the way and setting the example.
[00:51:26] Greg Bell: [00:51:26] Well, that is awesome. I honestly don't remember the law school conversation, but I do know that I admired you in terms of like who you were, just, I had so much respect for you. You know, athletically of course, but also just as a who you were and how you showed up in the world. But it's interesting that I advised you to go to law school because it's a funny story, because, my social studies teacher in high school advised me to go to law school. He says, Hey, you should think about going to law school. And at the time, my father, eighth grade education, my [00:52:00] grandfather, no education, no one in my family had ever gone to college. I didn't know what a lawyer did or whatever. And here's my social studies teacher telling me I should go to law school.
[00:52:09] I was like, what, what are you talking about? And it was interesting, so you fast forward that, so. he plants that seed in my mind. And in my second year of law school, I mean, we're having books stacked on both sides of me going, what am I doing here? And I couldn't figure it out. And I went, Ralph Bershire.
[00:52:26] So I actually called him. I said, mr. Berkshire, this is Greg bell. You know what he said? Who?.
[00:52:35] Yeah. I had to convince him that he knew me and then it was funny about it. Then I had to convince him that we had this conversation. He goes, Oh yeah, I read this article. I was trying to be a journalist. And I wrote in the paper and I was probably all these run-on sentences. He says, I thought you were a good writer.
[00:52:50] You should go to law school. That's what he said. And it was interesting that idea. I mean, this is back to you. About impact. [00:53:00] Yeah, because you're having conversations with people. You're not sure the impact in the wake you're gonna have on them, but giving somebody confidence that way and encouraging them.
[00:53:09] Is one of the most powerful things we can do as a human. I mean, walking around for us, I think is really interesting. I'm not walking around and get a new house or a new car. That's not why we're walking around. We're walking around to do what you do and that is to have impact. And that's what I appreciate about you.
[00:53:25] I think it's just remarkable. I think anyone listening should visit your website, your social. I just really admire what you've done in the short time you've been a professional speaker, but just your whole career, what you've done personally, and just your family. I just admire you so, so much. So I just really appreciate you taking the time to be on the podcast and just, just who you are as a person.
[00:53:46] JJ Birden: [00:53:46] Oh, thank you too. And back at you because you know, I always want it to be more than an athlete. I didn't want to just be an athlete. So I was, I was always looking to see what other athletes were doing and that's how you, why you made an impact on me [00:54:00] because you weren't just a basketball player.
[00:54:01] You were moving on to the next phase of your life. And I had no idea I was going to spend nine years in the NFL, but still the concept of being more than an athlete always drove me. And I think that's why you see me doing what I'm doing today.
[00:54:16] Greg Bell: [00:54:16] Yeah, that is terrific. So you, you, you're gonna, you're obligated now to do the Water the Bamboo oath.
[00:54:22] Okay. Since you're on the bamboo podcast, so you have to raise your right hand. I got my Water the Bamboo band on here. Raise your right hand.
[00:54:31] No matter what challenges come my way.
[00:54:33] JJ Birden: [00:54:33] No matter what challenges come our way,
[00:54:35] Greg Bell: [00:54:35] I will.
[00:54:36] JJ Birden: [00:54:36] I will
[00:54:37] Greg Bell: [00:54:37] continue to water the bamboo.
[00:54:40] JJ Birden: [00:54:40] Continue to water the bamboo.
[00:54:42] Greg Bell: [00:54:42] Okay,JJ, I really appreciate you, man.
[00:54:45] JJ Birden: [00:54:45] Keep up the good work and I can't wait til everyone hears the awesome content you're going to be sharing through your podcasts.
[00:54:52] Greg Bell: [00:54:52] Thank you very much. I really, I really, really appreciate your time, man. It's it's great. Keep after it, let me know if there's anything I can do, you know, text me or whatever.
[00:55:00] [00:55:00] Just a side note. that was funny as going out to your high school, my daughter playing basketball and seeing your trophies and pictures everywhere. I was like, JJ is everywhere. That was fun.
[00:55:15] JJ Birden: [00:55:15] I'm famous now, though, for there was a senior prank years ago and they stole all of the pictures. And then they return all the pictures, but they never returned my football picture.
[00:55:26] Greg Bell: [00:55:26] Oh no.
[00:55:27] JJ Birden: [00:55:27] So I'm famous now for having the only picture that was taken from the senior prank and it's still not fair.
[00:55:35] Greg Bell: [00:55:35] We'll just, we'll have a search party out for it. We'll get to find that picture who has it, you know, that's so funny.
[00:55:43] JJ Birden: [00:55:43] When you, whenever you release this and all that, cause I will definitely mark it.
[00:55:49] Greg Bell: [00:55:49] Thank you very much. And you know, I just, let me know how I can return the favor with anything. Okay.
[00:55:53] I will. Thank you, Greg. Have a good day. Okay buddy, take care. Have a good weekend.
[00:55:58] What a great [00:56:00] guy. I love JJ. And I learned so much from him and his ideas on mentorship. Things that many of us can benefit from.
[00:56:07] If you haven't already make sure you subscribe to the Water the Bamboo podcast, wherever you get your podcasts. Until next time, I'm Greg bell. Keep watering.